tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post8954793891921675970..comments2023-12-11T06:02:28.864-05:00Comments on The Wise Fool: Fishy BreadTWFhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-41534200122218423572013-06-04T14:35:59.783-04:002013-06-04T14:35:59.783-04:00Anonymous, do not forget that what we have here is...<b>Anonymous</b>, do not forget that what we have here is four authors telling basically the same story six times. I could easily understand one, or maybe even two authors "cutting to the chase" as you say, but it does not make sense for none of the four authors mentioning the miraculous appearance of the bread in the six times in which they spoke about it. Plus, when you have verses like Matthew 16:9/Mark 6:52, it is not so clear that they were sufficiently surprised.TWFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-66605082215906429802013-06-03T10:04:43.961-04:002013-06-03T10:04:43.961-04:00You said, "They did not report the bread appe...You said, "They did not report the bread appearing from nothing...the surprise...upon reaching into the baskets and continually finding more bread to distribute...etc."<br /><br />I can understand that these details might make for better prose, but you and I both know intuitively that the observers were surprised - don't we? Feeding what was probably at least 10,000 people (factoring in woman and children) with 5 loaves of bread and 2 fish are the only details necessary to drive home the point that Jesus has done something remarkable and astonishing.<br />In other words, the author is merely "cutting to the chase."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-64767413916230329432013-06-02T22:25:22.749-04:002013-06-02T22:25:22.749-04:00Anonymous
You said "Absence of certain detail...<b>Anonymous</b><br />You said "<i>Absence of certain details in the narratives are due to the witnesses reporting what they saw rather than what they did not understand (i.e. how is something made from nothing? ).</i>"<br /><br />I think I understand what you are saying, but, at the same time, you are highlighting the point I am making. They did not report what they saw. They did not report the bread appearing from nothing. They did not report the surprise they upon reaching into the baskets and continually finding more bread. They did not mention a sudden pile of bread to distribute. If they had, I would not have been able to make the main point of the post.<br /><br />They would not have to understand it to witness it. And given that people tend to remark upon the remarkable, seeing such a miracle occur should have been included in the text, in my opinion.TWFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-70063924546076460962013-06-02T21:23:21.106-04:002013-06-02T21:23:21.106-04:00As true God, Jesus performed a miracle of the high...As true God, Jesus performed a miracle of the highest order (creating something from nothing). As true Man, he (from the elemental ingredients) produced the work of human hands, namely, baked loaves. The speed at which this occurred is what sets it apart from the everyday miracles. The Jews consider bread a gift from God! I am reminded of a statement offered by a baker friend of my wife as she watched bread baking: "It's not me doing this". Absence of certain details in the narratives are due to the witnesses reporting what they saw rather than what they did not understand (i.e. how is something made from nothing? ).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-30984449329696206982013-04-07T10:18:34.795-04:002013-04-07T10:18:34.795-04:00Sharing such a small amount would have been nice, ...Sharing such a small amount would have been nice, huh <b>Anon</b>?TWFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-63398675956853389472013-04-06T01:41:40.772-04:002013-04-06T01:41:40.772-04:00I would personally find sharing a small amount of ...I would personally find sharing a small amount of food fairly between a large number of people more impressive (at least when considering compassion) than miraculously multiplying a bounty on hand.<br /><br />That would be a practical lesson that could easily be duplicated by anyone.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-1294494876109895422011-12-09T20:14:59.312-05:002011-12-09T20:14:59.312-05:00Thanks for the tip, Anonymous!
I would not be sur...Thanks for the tip, Anonymous!<br /><br />I would not be surprised to find Hebrew or Hellenistic influences as the seed for this miracle, but it would be interesting to see the take on it. I might check that out if I get a chance.<br /><br />As for the second book, from my studies, I can see the conclusions you describe about copying, tweaking, and John not being a unique eyewitness.TWFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-49057930310923120442011-12-09T19:59:20.667-05:002011-12-09T19:59:20.667-05:00Two new books on the feeding stories. The first bo...Two new books on the feeding stories. The first book points out a lot that's wrong with them, and also mentions both Hebrew and Hellenistic influences that probably gave birth to such a miracle tale: <br /><br />Feeding the Five Thousand: Studies in the Judaic Background of Mark 6:30-44 par. and John 6:1-15 (Studies in Judaism) by Roger David Aus http://www.amazon.com/Feeding-Five-Thousand-Studies-Background/dp/0761851526/ref=wl_it_dp_o_npd?ie=UTF8&coliid=IXMXC75E6QOJH&colid=3KKLY02YFTRNF<br /><br />The second book argues that the fourth Gospel author simply rewrote the feeding stories in the earlier Gospels and added his theological imagination to the rewritten mix. Quite a long sustained argument challenging those who think the fourth Gospel was composed by an independent eye witness: <br /><br />Rewriting the Feeding of Five Thousand (Studies in Biblical Literature) by Steven A. Hunt http://www.amazon.com/Rewriting-Feeding-Thousand-Biblical-Literature/dp/143310606X/ref=wl_it_dp_o_npd?ie=UTF8&coliid=I1SYECKG3C9L4R&colid=3KKLY02YFTRNF<br /><br />Good stuff, I read them both recently.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-15522217693990454022011-12-09T09:29:42.029-05:002011-12-09T09:29:42.029-05:00Thanks Paul! It is really weird, huh?Thanks Paul! It is really weird, huh?TWFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06016277303703254572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5509207392481380457.post-78171940994462737722011-12-09T07:52:49.849-05:002011-12-09T07:52:49.849-05:00Yours is quite a fascinating analysis. I haven...Yours is quite a fascinating analysis. I haven't seen anyone before point out quite the same weakness in the fish and bread stories.Paul Sunstonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02462598852553696040noreply@blogger.com